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Anonymous
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Really Am Skuj said 1 week ago

Moen wins Fukuoka in 2:05:48.

Is the the beginning of a Norwegian resurgence?

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    Really Am Skuj said 1 week ago

    Ooops. "Is this the beginning......" rather.

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    Andrew Jones said 1 week ago

    Quoting: Really Am Skuj
    "Is the the beginning of a Norwegian resurgence?"


    Darren, when was there a "surgence" ? :)

    But seriously, they've had some great runners on the female side (Waitz and Kristensen), not so much on the male side ('96 800m Oly Gold by Roedahl when Kipketer couldn't run) and good 'uns in the Kvalheim brothers, Halvorsen and Bakken.

    With Moen now and the audacious youngster Ingebrigsten and his bros. I suppose you could say they're up and coming?

    Perhaps if some of their (world beating) XC skiiers switched they would do better?

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    Really Am Skuj said 1 week ago

    Interesting chat with Canova:

    https://medium.com/alberto-stretti/coach-canova-my-opinion-about-sondre-moen-in-fukuoka-d4625cfeafa

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    Andrew Jones said 1 week ago



    I've watched some coaching seminars from Canova, and read his interviews and LR board inputs as much as I can. Although I like his personality and enthusiasm, I find he reveals very little about actual training methods, and prefers to focus on the mathematics of what his runners do in workouts and races (IE, pacing numbers, volume levels, interval workout formulations).

    Now, I know much of running training is scientific and hence quantitative, but I'd like to see and hear more from Canova on how he takes on a runner like Moen and transforms them markedly (above and beyond the usual "clean your mind and move to Kenya" bit).

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    Saskatuna said 2 days ago

    Quoting: Andrew Jones
    "I've watched some coaching seminars from Canova, and read his interviews and LR board inputs as much as I can. Although I like his personality and enthusiasm, I find he reveals very little about actual training methods, and prefers to focus on the mathematics of what his runners do in workouts and races (IE, pacing numbers, volume levels, interval workout formulations).

    Now, I know much of running training is scientific and hence quantitative, but I'd like to see and hear more from Canova on how he takes on a runner like Moen and transforms them markedly (above and beyond the usual "clean your mind and move to Kenya" bit)."


    https://runningscience.co.za/elite-athletes-training-log/renato-canova/

    Follow the link brotha his whole methodology is there. Also, Canova posted the training of Moen before Fukuoka on LetsRun,

    http://www.letsrun.com/forum/flat_read.php?thread=8576188

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    Andrew Jones said 2 days ago

    Thanks for this Sask. I have read those diaries and they seem a little too cut-and-dried (in light of Moen's meteoric rise, perhaps you can imagine where I'm going with this).

    So what I'm really looking for is not these matter-of-fact listings in which Canova's runners run 220 kms a week and can do 5x3kms at 9:00 at 7500ft., but some background on how they got there. In other words, what is the philosophy of the coach, and what discussions occurred between him and the athlete when he takes them on -- and over the long-term?

    The diaries I see from Canova look like cursory evidence given by a defence lawyer.

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  • powerboy User since:
    Dec 11th, 2014
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    powerboy said 2 days ago

    Quoting: Andrew Jones
    "Thanks for this Sask. I have read those diaries and they seem a little too cut-and-dried (in light of Moen's meteoric rise, perhaps you can imagine where I'm going with this).

    So what I'm really looking for is not these matter-of-fact listings in which Canova's runners run 220 kms a week and can do 5x3kms at 9:00 at 7500ft., but some background on how they got there. In other words, what is the philosophy of the coach, and what discussions occurred between him and the athlete when he takes them on -- and over the long-term?

    The diaries I see from Canova look like cursory evidence given by a defence lawyer."


    Andrew, I think I know what you mean, but I think the unspoken part is the fact that these guys start with such a high talent level. And then they build their base with a greater foundation than we are used to. ( The oft -quoted 2-3 workouts a day, with 16 k tempo virtually everyday)

    So when a few of those guys get to Canova , they can already run 2:10 in their sleep.

    As a few others have said over the years, it would be so interesting if Canova coached some typical North Americans who were running 28:30-29.00.

    But I have adapted some of Canova's workouts for my 800/1500 runners and can attest to their value.

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    Andrew Jones said 2 days ago

    So when a few of those guys get to Canova , they can already run 2:10 in their sleep.

    As a few others have said over the years, it would be so interesting if Canova coached some typical North Americans who were running 28:30-29.00.

    But I have adapted some of Canova's workouts for my 800/1500 runners and can attest to their value.


    Fair enough Mike. I know Moen was a ~2:10 guy heading into his "Canova experience" and perhaps all he needed was altitude + a very dedicated, high-volume program + Canova's expertise to get to the next level.

    I suppose I think of Reid Coolsaet and how he was comparable to Moen (in fact, I think Reid's 10000m time was much better than Moen's) before heading to Kenya. The fact that Reid did not experience this quantum leap perhaps has to do with, say, his adaptation to altitude (not all athletes adapt the same), or lack of a Canova-like program? (I ask this rhetorically, leaving out the other possibility :))

    I agree that it would be great to see, say, a guy like the (retired) Kelly Weibe or Rory Linkletter do "a Moen" and submit to a Canova-like East African-based program.

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  • new-post-last-visitsaskatuna User since:
    Dec 13th, 2017
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    Saskatuna said 2 days ago

    Word up. I always forget about how these athletes do come to Canova having built what he refers to as their "aerobic house". It certainly would be more interesting to see what is done to improve athletes before they have these huge breakthroughs like Sondre Moen. Perhaps the athletes under Canova follow his principles but emphasize aerobic building first before increasing the intensity to pull off fast marathons.

    If the athletes in question adopted this high level of intensity while maintaining the volume like in Canova's method of elite athletes, I would guess that many 28min to 29min runners would be capable of dropping down to the 2:08-2:10 range, having already established themselves as 2:12-2:15 marathoners. Perhaps look at the Japanese marathon scene, many athletes run in the mentioned 10km range and a good handful go sub 2:10 in the marathon.
    However, this is all speculation, who knows what would actually happen!

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